In the latest episode of Raw Minds, hosts Erick and Joey embark on a profound exploration of the intricate interplay between addiction and men's mental health. This raw and emotionally charged episode delves into the depths of the human experience as they are joined by the courageous and introspective guest, Jordan, who returns for the second time to share his poignant journey of grappling with addiction for a staggering 18 years.
The title "Handcuffed to the Devil" sets the tone for a conversation that confronts the darkness and struggles that often accompany addiction, likening the grip of substance abuse to a malevolent force that ensnares the soul. Through Jordan's candid and honest account, listeners are granted an intimate glimpse into the tumultuous landscape of addiction, witnessing firsthand the harrowing effects it can have on one's mental well-being, relationships, and sense of self.
Erick, Joey, and Jordan navigate the complexities of addiction with empathy and understanding, exploring the multifaceted challenges that individuals face when attempting to break free from its chains. From the initial allure of substances to the devastating consequences that ensue, they illuminate the cyclical nature of addiction and the profound impact it has on the lives of those affected.
As the conversation unfolds, themes of resilience, redemption, and hope emerge, painting a vivid portrait of the human spirit's capacity for transformation and healing. Jordan's unwavering honesty and vulnerability serve as a beacon of light in the darkness, offering solace and inspiration to listeners who may find themselves grappling with similar struggles.
Through their exploration of addiction within the context of men's mental health, Erick and Joey create a safe space for reflection, introspection, and dialogue, fostering a sense of community and understanding around these often stigmatized topics. This episode of Raw Minds stands as a testament to the power of storytelling, empathy, and human connection in the journey toward healing and self-discovery.
Tune in to this riveting episode as Raw Minds delves deep into the complexities of addiction, shining a light on the shadows that haunt the human psyche and illuminating the path to liberation and renewal. It is a testament to the resilience of the human spirit and a reminder that, even in our darkest moments, there is always the possibility of redemption and transformation.
In the latest episode of Raw Minds, hosts Erick and Joey embark on a profound exploration of the intricate interplay between addiction and men's mental health. This raw and emotionally charged episode delves into the depths of the human experience as they are joined by the courageous and introspective guest, Jordan, who returns for the second time to share his poignant journey of grappling with addiction for a staggering 18 years.
The title "Handcuffed to the Devil" sets the tone for a conversation that confronts the darkness and struggles that often accompany addiction, likening the grip of substance abuse to a malevolent force that ensnares the soul. Through Jordan's candid and honest account, listeners are granted an intimate glimpse into the tumultuous landscape of addiction, witnessing firsthand the harrowing effects it can have on one's mental well-being, relationships, and sense of self.
Erick, Joey, and Jordan navigate the complexities of addiction with empathy and understanding, exploring the multifaceted challenges that individuals face when attempting to break free from its chains. From the initial allure of substances to the devastating consequences that ensue, they illuminate the cyclical nature of addiction and the profound impact it has on the lives of those affected.
As the conversation unfolds, themes of resilience, redemption, and hope emerge, painting a vivid portrait of the human spirit's capacity for transformation and healing. Jordan's unwavering honesty and vulnerability serve as a beacon of light in the darkness, offering solace and inspiration to listeners who may find themselves grappling with similar struggles.
Through their exploration of addiction within the context of men's mental health, Erick and Joey create a safe space for reflection, introspection, and dialogue, fostering a sense of community and understanding around these often stigmatized topics. This episode of Raw Minds stands as a testament to the power of storytelling, empathy, and human connection in the journey toward healing and self-discovery.
Tune in to this riveting episode as Raw Minds delves deep into the complexities of addiction, shining a light on the shadows that haunt the human psyche and illuminating the path to liberation and renewal. It is a testament to the resilience of the human spirit and a reminder that, even in our darkest moments, there is always the possibility of redemption and transformation.
yeah yo, here we go. Once again, we are back to the podcast that shatters the silence on men's mental health. We are unedited, unfiltered and, as always, we are going raw.
Speaker 2:My name is joey and I'm eric and we're your hosts and welcome to raw minds.
Speaker 3:All right, man buddy we're doing it again, as always all the time every week putting in that work putting in that work man just trying to help people, and you know anyone that's new tuning in to our show. We are the podcast on men's mental health. Me myself and Eric, we have lived our lives in probably some of the worst traumas family loss, abuse, child abuse, you name it. You know we've lived it. That's why we come on here every week to let you guys know that it's okay to talk about these things and that there are better days on the other side. That's why we're here and that's why we keep doing what we do. Hell, yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:I want to say how was your June? Did you feel that men's mental health awareness was pushed out as much as we all would like it to be? Nope, I don't think so either.
Speaker 3:No, you see clips about men's mental health, but there's no backing to that. You know what I mean. Like there's stats men's suicide is up for. We know this, but what's being done about it?
Speaker 3:nothing much and that's why we sit here. We talk about this a lot, especially in the last month, about men's mental health awareness for the month. But why isn't it every day? It should be. Why isn't anyone's mental health made more aware every day? Because it's a serious problem? Yeah, you know, especially in men. I'm not taking away from women by any means, because we all, we all deal with shit, we all struggle, you know, but it's it's not talked about enough, it's not made aware enough, it's not taken seriously enough. And as it should be, because you know, especially nowadays, as the cost of living, everything it should be. Because you know, especially nowadays, as the cost of living, everything goes up, the expectations of being a man is still the same. It's true, man, you know, we're the providers, we're the protectors. We got to pay the bills, we got to work 15 hour days, but it's, it's, it's getting harder and harder.
Speaker 3:man it really is like we always talk about man is wearing. You know, us men especially that walk out our door every morning wearing that backpack full of bricks and it's getting real heavy for a lot of people. Yeah, and that's why we sit here every week is to talk to you guys and hopefully help you guys relieve some of that weight well, you got to put in the work right.
Speaker 2:That's about putting the work. You can't sit around and just think that it's going to happen.
Speaker 3:So no, of course not right like you're.
Speaker 3:You're going to make the changes. When you're ready to make those changes, definitely, definitely. You're going to put in the work because you want to put in the work. If you don't change, nothing will change. Yeah Right, and it's not easy, especially when you've been doing something for so long, like your job or whatever, and you're just paying the mortgage and you know you've got to take care of your kids, but you're miserable. At the same time, you're not fulfilled, you're not living out your, your purpose, but you're doing it for your family, as every most good men do.
Speaker 2:But at the same time was we're, we're struggling internally yeah, man, you got to fill your cup right and whatever that looks like to you. You know you got to do things that you know is going to benefit you in life. You know, like we said before in the past episodes and you've probably even seen it online is you take a cup, say like red food dye or whatever you want to put in it, right, and you just keep on pouring water in that, Eventually that red food dye is going to turn out of there and it's just going to be normal water.
Speaker 3:It'll be clear again. Yeah, and that's what we're shooting. That's what anybody shoots for is. Everyone just wants to be happy. I just want to be happy, yeah, well, it's really it's you're trying to find the clarity in your mind, so that clear water, you know, pushes out that poison and that toxic mindset, basically, and the damage that we hold on to, that we don't deal with. So we're able to be in the moment and be present when you're with your children and with your wife and at work. That's the key. It's not finding the happiness, it's finding the clarity. Really. Yeah, definitely, you can be happy in today, because this is all we got right. We only have today. We don't have tomorrow yet. We don't have, like, yesterday's gone, it's today. What can we do today to live the fullest and be the happiest today?
Speaker 2:Well, let's face it, time is the most precious thing in this world. You know what I mean. There's nothing. You cannot get time back you can't, it's, it's impossible, unless you're a time traveler, which, uh, cia probably has. They just haven't released the patents to anybody, but that's a different podcast.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but it's true, it's time. Everyone seems to think that we have all this time and the things that we do, but we don't know Tomorrow's not promised. No, you know, your life can go in a second, but we take that for granted, right? We don't really think about that, even though we know it. But we don't live like that. You're not living for today. We're so stressed out about next month, three months from now, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's true. Like I said last podcast man, you got to live your life like imagine you can't swim, right, you get dropped in the middle of the lake. You're going to fight for your life. You know to be able to breathe in that water. You're going to be splashing and just fighting for your life. You need to take that mentality and put it into your life and everything that you do. Right it's true, man?
Speaker 3:Well, and that's the thing, is that weight that I said you know that we carry when we leave the house is what's causing a lot of men to drown? Yeah, Because they can't tread above that water anymore and they're drowning? Yeah, and they can't breathe? Yeah, that's true, man, and that's that's the biggest problem. Is that the weight that we carry when we leave every day? Most men, instead of trying to take bricks out, we just keep adding bricks to that backpack and we ended up drowning ourselves.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like it's fun or something like we want to do that. No, you want to get rid of that shit, not add to it.
Speaker 3:But in order to release that weight in the backpack that we carry is, you have to be able to turn around and face the demons that chase you in the night. You have to turn around and face those traum that chase you in the night. You have to turn around and face those traumas. Look in the mirror, take accountability for anything that you've done to be able to fix that. That's the only way you can do it. Instead, we hold on to it because we're men and we're not supposed to talk about it and we're going to be a little bitch if we cry.
Speaker 3:And you don't want your wife to know that you're breaking inside. And I get it, man, I was there, we were all there. You, you feel ashamed. You, you feel like you're not a man. Yeah, because you're hurting. And you just don't want you know, your significant other, your kids, to know that you're, you're, you're, you're breaking. So we, we, we fucking suck it all up, push it down and keep pushing. But you keep doing that long enough and that's what happened to me and that's what happens to a lot of people is you hit that breaking point, man, and you think you hit rock bottom? Well, I tell you, rock bottom's got a basement, yeah, man, and that basement is the fucking graveyard.
Speaker 3:No coming back from that shit, no, and you don't and you don't. And too many men especially are getting to that point where it's easier for them to take a forever nap than it is to wake up the next day. Ain't that the try to push through that day? And it's? It's truly sad. You know, we were there, I was there, I tried to take my own life twice, man, literally, and it's a really dark place to be in where, regardless of the family and friends you have and what's going on good in your life, and you feel like that and you just think it's better that I just can't go another day. I can't deal with what's going on in my head anymore.
Speaker 1:It doesn't stop. Thanks for having me back.
Speaker 3:So that's why people take on a lot of themselves. Sad man.
Speaker 1:Oh man.
Speaker 2:Well, I think it's a good time to introduce our guest here. Yes, sir.
Speaker 3:We are welcoming him back. He was a guest on our fourth episode. Four Was it four.
Speaker 1:I think it was four. The last year has been pretty wild.
Speaker 2:It was four First video, wasn't it?
Speaker 3:No, it's good this gentleman with us tonight. If you are new to the show, has overcome and you know still dealing with his day-to-day from it but years of addiction. You know drug use, drug sales from younger to where he is today, to be honest, is a real inspiration and we're really proud of him. So, without further ado, we'd like to welcome Jordan to the show. Welcome Jordan, Welcome back. Always, my friend, always.
Speaker 2:How's life in your world?
Speaker 1:and not do anything about it. And, uh, you know that those issues when those creep back up and and end up get you and getting you when you're not looking, and but until you actually do the work ain't that the truth? And and. Doing the work on yourself is the the most important work that you can do. Man, you get the most out of it.
Speaker 1:You can go to work and bust your ass for 15 hours a day, but you know, spending one hour a day working on you, you're going to get so much further ahead than those, those 15 hours at work.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, from what your stories from last episode, man yeah, definitely accomplishments left and right. Yeah, from what your story is from last episode, man yeah, definitely accomplishments left and right, man, so good for you.
Speaker 1:No man, work like, put the work into yourself, go and talk to somebody and that's where it really all starts, man Like, until you can really open up and talk, and that was one of my biggest issues and one of the things that helped me the most was just being able to open up and realizing that you're not alone and there's other people out there that are going through the same shit that you are. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm, totally, man. You think that nobody's going through what you've gone through. Nobody's as messed up as you are.
Speaker 2:Nobody's had to deal with the things that you have definitely, definitely, and then I would, I would, I would say that definitely, like, as long as you're doing the, the right work, right? You know what I mean. You know na not sitting around and playing video games. As soon as you walk into one of those rooms, are you working to fix yourself?
Speaker 1:you know every single one of those people in there are going through the exact same thing.
Speaker 3:you are Sure their story's a little bit different.
Speaker 1:But if you took their name out, put my name in the story's very similar. Everything that they're dealing with, it's all very similar, and that's one of the biggest sayings in it is you are not alone.
Speaker 3:Yeah, exactly yeah. It's a tough one, man, because when you're in that and you are by yourself and you feel alone, you feel like you are the only one right. And you feel and just like I felt at one point is when you're in that you feel like if you talk about it, nobody would understand how you're feeling, because you feel like you're the only one that's feeling like that's the hardest thing that you'll you'll ever have to do, but it's also the most rewarding right.
Speaker 1:Anything that's anything that's worth doing is difficult, and you know, whether it's being clean and getting off the drugs or getting yourself into a better mental state, or, you know, working on your physical appearance or whatever it may be. Anything that is difficult or anything that is worth doing is difficult. You know, and, yeah, you know, like you said, the ongoing battle with the drugs. You know it's, it's every day, it's every moment, and you know what. Yeah, you break it down to minutes and hours if you have to. Hey, you know what.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the hardest thing I would say, though, definitely and we've touched on this before is you know, the biggest battle really is yourself.
Speaker 2:You know you're battling yourself in your mind. At the end of the day it's a huge mental battle that you have to battle Because you know, at one point you're like, you know, for addiction for example, you want the drug, but the other side, you know I have to stay clean, you know, but you want it. And it's a tough battle and it's not just one time. I mean a lot of people, you know, they deal with this hundreds of thousands of times a day, you know, and it gets exhausting, that you know. Sometimes people just give up because it just gets exhausting, man, you know, and it's a hard battle. Just give up because it just gets exhausting, man, you know, and it's a hard battle. 100%, yeah, yeah, exactly exactly that's, that's totally true.
Speaker 1:And you know you can. When somebody's struggling, you know you can go to them and you can point out all the facts. You can talk to your blue in the face. You can, you know, lead them to. You know solutions. But until somebody's actually ready to accept help and admit that they have a problem one way or the other, whether it's drugs, alcohol, depression, whatever it is until they can actually be honest with themselves, they won't accept the help.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's all. Yeah, you have to, and like we say that, one degree right, we, we preach that all the time. It's just, you know it takes time, but eventually you're gonna get there. It's a slow game really.
Speaker 3:At the end of the day it's you gotta play the slow game well, our, you know, our last guest last week said it and he nailed it on the head it's it's choose your heart, right. Do you want to choose or keep choosing to live this addictive life? You know you're, you're disappointing your family, your children, you're not around for your children, your relationships failing, like that's extremely difficult. But then you have the other side where, yeah, you know, overcoming any addiction is, you know, getting over the sickness, the detoxing, the, the rehab, the counseling, and that is another extremely hard thing to do. But which hard do you would you rather have? Yeah, so really, just picking which hard? Right, they're both hard. So really, it's picking which hard, right? Yeah, they're both hard. But at the end of the day, nobody will change unless they want to change.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it's true, they need to want it. I mean, like, what's that saying? Uh, you can take the horse to the water, but you can't make them drink it oh, that's exactly it, right, like like, for example, my son's mother.
Speaker 3:She is now a homeless drug addict and I've had to deal with this with my son now for four plus years and it's truly heartbreaking because she was a really good mother and she was obsessed with my son at one point and really annoyed me every time I had him calling. Can I talk to him and I love him and this and it was great. I'd rather have that back than what. The path she's chosen? Yeah, because it's truly heartbreaking to just have my son's birthday and she doesn't even call him on his birthday. Yeah, and four years ago she's planning birthday parties and getting mad at me because this doesn't look right and I forgot the cake and this and that, and now she's not even there, she's gone and and she's living 10 minutes from me in a tent beside her kids and she doesn't even come around anymore because of the choice that she made.
Speaker 3:And you know, again, with the help, is as much resentment as I held against her for doing that, not only to herself, because she was a good person, but what she's doing to my son, who's now 14, who doesn't have his mother, and I've reached out, her parents have reached out, offered to pay for the best rehabs and social services when they took my son away from her, laid out an entire plan for her, paid for, and she didn't want to help. She truly believed she didn't have a problem and basically said F you, and now she's 70 pounds, no teeth, and she used to be a beautiful-looking girl, but that's the choice that she made and there's nothing any of us can do about it. So I had to learn to let that go and only do what I can for my son, because that's all he's got left besides his, you know, grandma, grandpas and whatnot, yeah, but for a parent, I, I'm all he's got well, a lot of people don't understand that, like you know, you're playing with this shit, you get addicted, you're affecting especially children.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean. Then your, your mom's not around, dad's not around, right, and that just that just adds crazy trauma onto people. You get um, separation disorder, depression, I mean. The list goes on. Because of this and because of you know, you make this choice and go do this. So I mean there's a lot of also, um, what's the word?
Speaker 3:um, um, not outcomes, um, I don't know anyways, like the butterfly, yeah yeah, I mean and it goes on and then, like from the addicts, go ahead side yeah, like the like, for example, her, like she's just a bomb that went off and now all the shrapnels hitting all the family, exactly exactly, and it's really sad and then.
Speaker 3:And then it down to like how does her parents feel watching her daughter like this? How does her, like my son, her friends, like I, got messages like this has been going on for four years. I've seen her once in over two years and I still have some of her old friends message me like I'm thinking about her. I'm really worried about her. Like people are affected and it trickles all the way down and not only like my son. Right now seems okay, but we don't know the severity of that effect on him long term as he gets older, with abandonment issues, because his mother was there and literally overnight he was taken away. Yeah, and now all of a sudden he doesn't have his mom and he doesn't know why, because he was nine at the time. Yeah, he doesn't understand it and he doesn't understand it.
Speaker 3:And then my son had double leg surgery two years ago. She didn't show up to the hospital. I tried to get her to come see him. She, she didn't show up and I stayed beside. I tried to get her to come see him. She didn't show up, and I stayed beside him and laid in that hospital room with him for an entire week until he was able to go home and the first time she's seen him, I think it was like four weeks after that, so it was truly heartbreaking.
Speaker 3:But the after effects as well, from you know, the people that you see fall apart like that and throw their lives away. It's, it's truly heartbreaking and it's sad, you know, and I mean, look at our guest jordan here. Man, he, he lived that life for many years and you know I'm sure he can go off here in a minute about his more of his backstory a little bit, but he understands it and a lot of people are dealing with it. And whether you've dealt with it, whether you've overcome or had an addiction, or you definitely know somebody who has the issue of addiction or is trying to get over it right now. You got a family, you got a friend. We've lost friends. I'm sure majority of people have lost friends from, especially nowadays with the ods, yeah, you know, especially the young kids and all that.
Speaker 2:I mean it's, it's, it's devastating yeah, it's doesn't matter what age you are. I mean, I saw on the news what was it a 14 year old, I think od'd off a fentanyl like a couple weeks ago. 14 man, what the hell's a 14? You know what I mean? It's sad like the the this, this, it's fucked. You know the streets well.
Speaker 2:Actually, what I don't even understand, man, is you got the drug dealers and they're giving out fentanyl like they first laced it with their heroin. So why are you out there trying to like and then like fentanyl is killing people? So why are you out there trying to and then like fentanyl is killing people? So why are you out there killing your fucking customers in the first place? Second place, what the fuck are you guys doing with this shit anyways, this shit's dangerous man, it's a bug like. I don't understand it. Man, yeah, yeah, obviously, yeah, yeah, obviously, yeah, mm-hmm, that's crazy. Man, yeah, oh, I got, I got a wild one for you. Man, okay, so my fiance, right, she, she passed away from. She overdosed.
Speaker 2:She was clean for so many years, um, but one time, like when I, when I first found out about this, uh, she, it was like when covid was around, she was pretending off like she had covid and it was something weird about her. And then she like was videoing me, face like, facetiming me, and I saw on her toes track marks and I know what track marks. I sold crack and heroin for seven years of my life, like I, like I back when I was younger, in my 20s right, I know what this shit looks like. And I'm like what the hell? And she's like, oh, I have COVID, I have COVID. I'm like, okay, I'll see you when you get better.
Speaker 2:And I hung up the phone and I hopped in my car and I drove straight to her house. And when, when I got to her house, I walked in and there was this chick I swear to God, she was just straight off the streets. She was like doing the hasting shuffle, as we call it, and I'm like who the hell is this like in my girl's house? And it was freaking me out. I'm like where's Jules? And she's like, oh, she's in the bathroom. I go right in the bathroom and there she is sitting on the toilet and she's got the thing in her arm and it was like experiencing that and in her I wouldn't say friend, but at that time they're, you know, they're used together.
Speaker 2:She was pissed off at Jules because she Narcan'd her and it ruined her high and she can't get high. For what? Half an hour or whatever it was and she was pissed. She was pacing back and forth you bitch, you bitch. Oh yeah, he's gone. But I mean she was racing back and forth you bitch, you bitch, you ruined. You ruined my high. It was crazy man, you know it. Just like you're dying, you're ODing and you're getting mad that someone Narcan'd you and to save your life, yeah, it's wild.
Speaker 1:You know, I know of a few people. Same thing. They were overdosing, they got Narcancan and yeah they were. They were mad that their high got ruined, like it's it that that drug is so powerful man like it.
Speaker 1:Uh, so the first time I used was, um, I I used to be pretty big into to dealing. I had access to whatever I wanted, whenever I wanted. And you know that's back when, like perks and oxys were big and you know I was eating, I don't know, 20, 30 plus perks a day, and then decided to OK, well, hey, let's, let's try heroin. You know people have asked, you know so you know I can get it, I can make some money. And you know people have asked, you know so, uh, you know I can get it, I can make some money, and you know I can get high and hold on.
Speaker 2:Can I just stop you there for a second? So what? What was the initial draw? Oh, keep losing them. Yeah, um, there we are. So what was the initial draw for you? To, um, do that like, do do the h, do the down, do the hair. What was like? What really brought you in?
Speaker 1:or was it just kind of like, yeah, well, I was already addicted to opiates like the, the perks and the oxys and what? What started? That okay I got into a fight when I was younger, um, and when I hit the kid, his teeth went through my hand and the doctor actually put me on perks. I had to have surgery on my hand and the doctor put me on Percocets and I was well how old? Was I 19, I was 20, 20. How old was?
Speaker 2:I 20 21 yeah. I think 20.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you just snowballed from there pretty much at that time and hey, this stuff is supposed to be stronger than that and let's see what it's like. And yeah, so that would have been even maybe more than 18 years ago now, 19 years ago, and I can honestly still remember the first time I got high from, from heroin and it's, it's so powerful.
Speaker 2:Man like yeah wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy yeah, yeah, well, and it's true, you're chasing the dragon, right. You're just chasing that. That first time is really what it is. That's what I did with um ketamine. I used to love ketamine. Was never addicted to it, but I was. I go to raves all the time, right, and that's it, and I would always try to chase the very first time I did ketamine. I used to love ketamine, was never addicted to it, but I was. I go to raves all the time, right, and that's it, and I would always try to chase the very first time I did ketamine, and it's just you're chasing that that you know, whatever it is, right, and that's it.
Speaker 2:It numbs, that's how like you get sucked in right.
Speaker 1:So most like sometimes if you have low self-worth, or if you're dealing with depression or you know, if you're, you're all you're not loving life. And you're in that, that sir, that toxic circle. You get high and life is great for an hour, two hours, and then it you know.
Speaker 1:You just right back to square one because you're constantly going around in circles, but once you actually get outside that circle and break the circle, man, you, you look back and you know, like the life that I live now compared to what I lived a few years ago, completely different. I don't want to change it for the world. Yeah, just like the way that, the way that I feel, the way that the way that I feel, the way that you know the direction my life is going, like it's just it's do the work. Like anybody out there, like you know, just do the work puts it on yourself.
Speaker 1:You're good, it'll pay you back a hundred fold.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, a hundred fold, yeah, yeah. Let's face it, you have to want it or not, and then you have two options you want it or not. At the end of the day, that's. That's what it comes down to, the choose your heart, right? Yeah?
Speaker 3:what was, uh, jordan? What was your, your, what would you say? The word is Breaking point, where you woke up one day and you're like I'm done, doing this to myself and to the people around me. What was it that made you wake up one day and be like I'm fucking done? That's it.
Speaker 2:The all. Moment.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the all moment where I'm like like I can't do this to myself.
Speaker 1:I don't remember driving the vehicle. Um, my, um, my fiance was in uh whistler at a marathon and she had to be brought back to the coast to come in and pick me up at the hospital. Um, just about, just about burnt my entire life to the ground um you know so that that happened.
Speaker 2:Well, I'm glad that you're here, man, you know, and you can push that, push that out there and hopefully help other people and save other people. I mean this guy's standing proof right here. Hard work, put it in and you know you'll still be here and push forward.
Speaker 1:You know, it was like anything right. I had some preconceived notions of what I was walking into. I was obviously nervous because my entire life was about to change. You know, something that I had been doing for 18 years uh, and how?
Speaker 3:how was that when you first got to the treatment center, the?
Speaker 1:direction of my life and after doing and right word. But you know, nervous, I guess, yeah, anxious, you know. How am I going to cope with this? Am I going to be able to do it? Am I going to be able to stay clean? What is my life going to look like without drugs? And you know, for the third, yeah, the, yeah, you know, I've always had self-worth anxious right like um and low self-esteem, and you know that's I've always put on the act. Um that, I'm super confident in that, um that uh um?
Speaker 2:were you scared of people judging you?
Speaker 1:what the other is that I'm looking for. But you know I've always yeah, yeah and you know, like I've always had to be the best at whatever I do, you know I always have to be the biggest at whatever I do. You know, I always have to be the biggest, you know I. And all of that relates back to the self-worth issues and the self-confidence.
Speaker 2:The mask. What a lot of men put on is the mask that, that clown mask that you're smiling on the outside but you know you're.
Speaker 1:You're actually frowning underneath that old pain About a week in you actually start to open your eyes and you're like, okay, you know, now I get it, you know this is making sense and you know this feels good and you actually start getting some emotions back and you start getting some clarity on things and you start actually having the time to focus on yourself and get down to the root of the issues. And best thing that you know one it's one of the so the two best things that have happened to me are, you know, the orchard and and Sydney. My fiance wouldn't be where I'm at without her and you know I wouldn't change either one of those for the world, Like I wouldn't with a yeah, and it'd be a very, a very different conversation if I didn't have both of those things in my life. Yeah, no.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3:well, I mean all everything that you went through, got you to this moment in time, right. So I mean, everything happened well and you know what? And and I will say too, like for his fiancee is no go ahead it's okay, keep on going but that's okay.
Speaker 3:But for for his fiancee, for example, like she, a lot of women, especially in her position at that time, like he just said, like he, basically he od'd on his kitchen floor and she had to leave something. She's been training for a marathon to leave to come pick him up from the hospital because of the choices that he made, obviously because she cares, but to have a woman as well that stood behind him to help him get through the treatment. You know the meetings afterwards, afterwards. And now this gentleman talking to us right now is living proof that he just went through 18 years of heroin addiction to now owning two homes and runs a car dealership and all these great things. Because he chose the other heart. He chose the other hard. He was tired of living that life and with that struggle and that hard to now, like he just said, like he wouldn't trade it for the world. And he's come so far and living proof that you can overcome and that there are, you know, a whole new life on the other side.
Speaker 3:You know, like you said when he walked into rehab, like his whole life he knew was going to change, yeah, and he knew that by walking in there that that's a change that he needed to make and he stuck behind that.
Speaker 3:You know, and there's a lot of people that go to rehab and and and relapse and fall out and go back and fall out, but they're they're not really ready to change because I don't think they've hit that rock bottom yet. You know, to a lot of people you like my, for example, my son's mother living in a tent, to most majority of people out there, that's a pretty low rock bottom, but for some people like her, that's that's not rock bottom because she's still not making that change. Like she has another kid not just my son with her boyfriend who's on the street with her sharing a tent that grant her ground, her mom, grandma, is fully taken custody of at three months old. And if the kids aren't going to help you make that change, then God help you. Then what does? Because I don't know, with some of these people, what do you need to realize that you can, you can't live like this and look at the people that it's affecting, like her children. Well, man, what about?
Speaker 2:what about, and and I mean this is it's going to happen. So I'm sorry to say this, but when she passes away and the like, who's going to take care of the kid then?
Speaker 3:you know what? I mean well, you know and that's the thing is like. You got grandparents who, like like her parents, my, my parents aren't together, but they live very far away yeah like hours and hours away.
Speaker 3:Both of them separate. Yeah, and her, her parents are a huge help. We get along and we're great. They help me when I go to work, you know, with my son. But at the other time, other side is now her. Her daughter is three, adorable kid, but the parents are 65, 67, like the grandpa had to give up retiring because now he's taking care of a three-year-old at 67 years old. But, like you said, like when, when they go, then what? Yeah, man, you know you. Then they really got nobody. Except they got me right, like that little girl's got no family here. They're from, you know, eastern Europe. There are families across the world. She's got nobody man, just those grandparents and my son. That's it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's what we talk about. You know, it affects like everything and that's like generations. It's going to affect another generation because, like you know, now this, this little girl is growing up with no, mom, you know, and that's what I say. And no father figure as well, you know, and we're growing up with the grandparents and do you know if she's she sees the um, the mom and dad? No, no, so I I mean, it's rough man, that, oh man, it breaks my heart, man.
Speaker 3:A lot of children deal with that and a lot of people and families deal with that. Well, Jordan can attest to that. How do you think his family was feeling while he was going through and doing the things?
Speaker 1:that he was doing for years.
Speaker 2:Actually, yeah, did they reach out or or, like, did contact you, or did they like kibosh, you Like? How did how did that go at all?
Speaker 1:I'm like, super, super, super close with my parents. But, um, you know, I'm I'm close with my family. Um, you know, my mom's, uh, an amazing woman. Uh, my dad's an amazing guy. Um, you know they, they checked up on me and they did everything that they could. Um, I wouldn't be again, I wouldn't be where I am without them. Um, they, you know they did the same thing for me that you know I was kind of talking about earlier. You know they would offer the support, they would tell me that I need help, they would do all the things to try and get me to accept help, but ultimately, until I was ready, it didn't matter.
Speaker 1:When I finally called my mom and told her, she broke down and she cried because she's, like you know I've been it's been 18 years of wondering when I was going to get the call that you passed away. And you know, now I can look back on on that stuff and you know it, it, yeah, it sucks to think what I put my parents through and you know, being so fucked up at, you know, christmas morning that I'm nodding out while my family's opening Christmas presents, like you know it's. Uh, yeah, you know you definitely do some damage to the family around you. Um, you know I've got some other addicts in my family and um, my cousin. You know he passed away from it and it does. It really traumatizes the family. And you know, while you're in that addiction you're so selfish and so self-centered that you really have no idea what you're doing to the people around you.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, it's hard. You know, I, I, I tried to do uh intervention on a really close friend of mine and, um, I brought a couple buddies over and he, he got pissed at me. It was, I think, four of us, five of us, and he was mad at me. He said like I embarrassed him and all this. But it wasn't man, I was, I was trying to do, you know, trying to save his life. At the end of the day it didn't work, but uh, I mean I tried, but, like you said, but you know, you just got a lot.
Speaker 3:Well, and that's the thing too, is a lot of people who have addiction issues or have problems like that, whether it's the drugs, alcohol, whatever it is, is the denial. Yeah, they don't want to believe that they have a problem. They don't want everybody to think that they have a problem when even though everyone knows they have a problem you're not hiding, that's why they get defensive is because to them, they don't have a problem, they're fine.
Speaker 3:Yeah, because they're not ready to change. They're not ready to look at themselves in the mirror and be like man, I need some fucking help, yeah, right. So that's where the anger comes from. And, like Jordan said, they're not looking at what they're doing to everyone around them, because all they can think about is the next high. Where are they going to get the next high? They don't want to get sick.
Speaker 2:They need that next drink.
Speaker 3:You know what I mean chasing the dragon buddy yeah, but uh, the effects you know and people got to realize when you have family and as heartbreaking as it is and, like jordan said, his family did this and and I've done this for my son's mom and her family's done this and you drive yourself into the ground because you care and that's why. But at the same time you have to step back and realize like, even though they're not making rational adult decisions, they're still an adult and they're going to do what they want to do and there's nothing you can do about it. Yeah, because I held onto that for a long time with what my son's mom did and I overworked myself when I tried to do this for my son even more, and then I would have anxiety every day and I'd be heartbroken and sad because of what she was doing to him and, just like you know, his Jordan's family was like deal or listening and seeing what he was putting himself through and what it was doing to them, and they're struggling and not sleeping at night because all they want to do is help, but they can't. But then you know, I got to a point for your own piece as much as you love the person or you care about them, you have to step back and be like until you're ready, I can't do anything. You can't keep letting it affect your life and everything around you because of other people's poor choices and because it's you know. You look at your son.
Speaker 3:Jordan's case was going through the. You know, as a mother and a father, they will do anything they can to help their, their child and especially as parents, looking at your child, that's doing it right. I I can't imagine if that was my son who was in that position, because I would. It would crush me, I wouldn't sleep, I wouldn't go to work, it would be fucking devastated. So I get it, but at the same time, like jordan said, until you're ready to change, then that's the only time or way it's going to change.
Speaker 3:Is that when that person is ready? You know majority, majority, like jordan, when we asked him, what is? You know what? What was his turning point to after 18 years? And his was he almost died. He almost burned his entire life to the ground and in one bad decision and almost killed himself on top of that. So, and a lot of these people, especially with addiction, is it takes something that severe before they either realize they need to change or to some like living in a tent. That's still not rock bottom. So what is the next thing past that is is sleeping in that basement? Yeah, is underneath that rock bottom, and that's truly sad, because there's not a day that goes by that just like jordan and his mother was waiting for that, call that my son's mom. The mom is gone because she is that.
Speaker 2:She is that bad see, that's what I was just gonna touch on. Man is like, you know, being a parent. You know you're a parent. You know you're a parent too. I can't imagine that.
Speaker 2:You know, like I have a friend that has a daughter that is gone, let's say, like I would be, I think it would be a miracle, I mean, and I hope it happens. But I mean, like she's gone like straight on the streets, living on the streets, you know, just at the lowest of the low right, and she's just gripped in the devil's clutch. You know, and I mean, people send her pictures all the time of like they saw her daughter. One time I saw a video, video and her daughter was literally it was all raining out and she was on the ground like just like crawling. You know, and I, I, god man, that you know, like how you're living like as a parent, you're living yourself in fear. You know, is that going to be the phone call? Every time the phone would ring? You know, oh god, I got crazy goosebumps. I mean, like that, like living like that too is just heavy. You know, think like putting in that, like that, that spectrum is just it's. Just thinking about that is that's.
Speaker 2:It's hard, you know, oh, extremely man, yeah, I just want to say like, if you, if you're listening and you, you have an addiction, you have some kind of poison. You know, just think about that. You know you really want that phone call to come to your parents or your loved ones saying they passed away. Just imagine putting yourself in that position. And if that's not enough to change you, man, I don't know.
Speaker 3:Well, not only that, your life is worth living. You have one life and it is worth living, whether you feel like it is or not. Totally, man, because everything that you are going through is temporary and how you feel is temporary, depending on the work that you put in and what you choose to do with the things that's happened to you and the things that you're choosing to do or have done. And and nobody's coming to save you except you yeah, right, so it's. You have to get to a point of choosing that hard on which way you're going to go, and it's not just because you you're afraid that your parents are going to get that call is because your life is important. Your life is worth living.
Speaker 3:Believe me, if you can go through what Jordan just said 18 years heroin to come out on the other side with owning homes and a great career, with an amazing fiance and if you can go through things like what we've gone through and why we do this, show child abuse, suffer child and physical and sexual abuse. I lost a son, I lost a nephew, and the list goes on. I try to kill myself twice. You same thing. Been through hell and back, but we chose at one point that that was enough and we had to figure out how to now face this that we carry and every man carries, especially the men that weight in that backpack that we wear every day we leave that house. So it's only up to you to choose to try to relieve some of those bricks rather than keep adding them.
Speaker 3:Pick your heart because, because I promise you and I bet you, if you ask jordan, in the 18 years of his addiction, never did he think that he'd be in the headspace and this point of his life that he's in now with how he thinks on the day to day and how much better he feels mentally.
Speaker 3:And it's the same with us and it's the same with a lot of people, if you're willing to put in that work, because I sat in 20 years of with a high anxiety disorder, depression, suicidal thoughts constantly and attempts, and never in my life could I imagine sitting here today and we we still struggle. Man, we all got our moments, we all got our shit and it's life, but to go from living in that to now, like I would think you're fucking nuts if you said that that's where I would be, you know, three, four years ago to now. So whatever it is that you are going through and Jordan is living proof especially if you're dealing with addiction right now or any sort of addiction but you have to choose the heart and which path you want to either stay on, which you already know what's going to happen if you stay on that path, and it's not a.
Speaker 3:It's not a good wrong like or do you pick the other hard road? Where you come out, you know it's feeling like you've never felt before, but your family's proud of you a whole lot more. Your kids love you. They want to spend time with you. Said anything difficult, you know you're making more money. You find a great job.
Speaker 1:You find some purpose in your life and being a positive.
Speaker 3:So what hard is it going to be?
Speaker 1:A positive role model. You know those are all difficult things but they're worth doing and you know so. One of the counselors at the orchard she had this really cheesy saying. It was it works if you work it and you're worth it. Well, that's one of the it's cheesy. We used to make fun of her every time she said it. But when you actually stop and think about it, it's true. It works if you work it and you are worth it.
Speaker 1:You know I struggled with self-worth and you know a lot of other people out there do too. Especially if you're down on yourself or if you're using or if you're in some kind of addiction, you think real low of yourself and you start thinking like you deserve what you're going through and you deserve to feel like shit. Well, you don't, but it's also on you to do something about it and everything that you go through makes you who you are today, right and totally. You know I went from you know a shithead drug dealer getting my door kicked in by the SWAT team, being in active addiction for years, always holding down a successful job, always been successful in the business world, but never really to my full potential. And you know I would string together a good couple of years, and then I'd fuck up Lessons.
Speaker 2:Learn your lessons.
Speaker 1:But you know I went from doing that to and then completely just about burning my life to the ground and in the last two years we've bought two houses. I'm now partners in the, in the dealership that you know I've always wanted to be. You know, in my. In the next five years, hopefully I own that dealership right Like that would have never happened if I didn't do the work on myself so yeah, it's true, man what are you?
Speaker 3:uh, real quick last question what are you? You know, coming from 18 years of heroin addiction and, like you said, and we all know this, regardless of what we've been through and how much better our lives are, we still struggle as day-to-day struggles. What do you find? Uh, you struggle with still the most. Now, even you know, after doing the work and like up to this point, because you said your life is night and day.
Speaker 1:You know a little bit more than the last two years is awesome Like it's.
Speaker 3:It's amazing for how far you've come and what you've accomplished. To come from that Cause. A lot of people don't get out of that. A lot of people are still in. But what do you feel coming to, coming from, as an 18 year addict, places today that you still struggle with the most in terms of in the last couple years?
Speaker 1:you know like kind of battle yeah, your heart is battle, keeping you know the clear mind and the staying so we had the urge to go out and use as weird as this sounds, my biggest trigger was just out of rehab. We were out in Edmonton and there was a couple guys that were sitting outside the hotel and they were nodding out like they were high, and that was my biggest trigger. I was like, oh, I bet they know where to get the good stuff. And I thought about it. And then right away I actually talked to Sid about it. I was like, hey, you know, what's really fucked up is that that triggers me? And she's like, really, she looks at it. She's like that triggers you. That's weird.
Speaker 1:I'm like, yeah, well, you know, hey, talk about it. Right, get it off your chest, deal with it. And that was that's been my one big trigger. Um, you know, yeah, like it was just the. The instant thought that went through my head was well, I bet they know where to get the good stuff. And then right away, kind of trying to scheme on how I could sneak away, and then I was like, well, okay, that's, that's, that's weird. But you know, I I caught myself and I talked about it and dealt with it and you know I've in actually tomorrow, I think tomorrow I'm 25 months sober.
Speaker 2:So, um, you know, I've been.
Speaker 1:I've been frustrated over the last two years. I've been annoyed, I've been pissed off. I've gone through every emotion seeing other people use and then like nodding out um you know it's nice because I can talk to, to sit about anything, I can call one of my friends I've got different support groups that you know we can reach out to, but I guess the one thing that I still struggle with is I never feel like I'm doing enough or I'm doing good enough. I could always be doing better, and that goes back to the self-worth.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, Good for you. Yeah, man good for you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, man, you know, that's a, that's a good one man, um, really, okay, so you go out and you use what is that going well?
Speaker 2:let me, let me um. Can we end this on this? What would you say to someone that is, you know, just on the brink of you know?
Speaker 2:wanting to use, but also want to fix themselves, like anyone listening that's, you know, struggling with something that's on that. You know that thin line of help or fuck it, let's just get high. What? What would you? Because you were in that position, what? Would you reach out and say Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, or did you? Oh, you're asking me that, sorry, no, no, no, I'm just saying something. Like someone just listening, you know, just um, oh, all I'm saying is, yeah, someone just listening, listening to the podcast. You know someone's struggling, you just going through a tough time.
Speaker 3:They want to change, but they're just you know, well, there's a lot of people too that do it, that get high now and they don't really want to do it anymore.
Speaker 2:They want to change, but they don't want to get sick yeah. But what advice can you give someone that's listening right now? That is T-Rex.
Speaker 1:And if it's an addiction, if it's any, if it's AA, one of the quickest, easiest, most accessible things go to a meeting Because you're going to walk into a room. There's going to be 20 other people who are going through the exact same thing as you. That range from one day sober to 20, 30 years, you know so. You're going to have all the support in the world. You're not going to feel alone. You're going to be everybody. You're going to be the most important person in the room and you'll be able to say how you feel, and without the fear of any judgment. So if you're sitting there and you're like, do I use, do I get help? You know, go get help. Take the first step. You have to take that first step. Take the first step and put the work into yourself so you know you can live a better life.
Speaker 2:Thank you, man.
Speaker 1:Cause you're, you are, you're worth it, Like it's. It's way more fun to be able to live life Proof no I hear a substance.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yes definitely Well said.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yes, definitely well said. Yeah, yeah, that's actually really. Yeah, that's what it's like. Right, you're in a prison. Yeah, you've caged yourself in a prison, you know, and handcuffed, like you said, to that substance and there's no key. But it's only up to you to ask for help to get that key.
Speaker 1:Nothing that you can say. Any story you can tell is something we haven't done ourselves.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's true. Yeah, well, jordan, I just want to say thank you, man, thank you for coming out and you know expressing and helping us, you know just making it aware that you know mental men's mental health is. We need to all work together to overcome this but if there is anybody, that and boss you know the final boss some addiction issues you know, and it's we have to come together.
Speaker 1:my contact info through Joey more than happy to have a conversation with anybody. Thank you, yeah, if you guys are.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you guys listening. You know, like Jordan just said, hit us up rawmindspodcast at gmailcom. Tiktok, my fitness, tick tock wherever it is. Man, you don't have to use your real name if you don't want, if you don't feel comfortable. This is why we do this show every week. We ain't go nowhere. We're here to raise the awareness of men's mental health every day, not just for one month.
Speaker 3:And you know, and obviously addiction is something that jordan here has dealt with for 18 years and understands it, been through it, has come out on the other side still, you know, still has his daily battles. But he, he's living proof that your life can change for the better and it is worth living. And if it's Jordan that you guys want to speak to directly he just offered it, inboxed us I'll let him know that you guys want to speak to him. If you're having that struggle where you really don't want to get high anymore and you're battling yourself, take that step. Like Jordan said, reach out. You know, talk to him, talk to us. Whatever you got to do, it's not worth it, man, it's not worth it.
Speaker 3:But that being said, I just want to thank everybody else for tuning in this week. We are the podcast that shatters the silence on men's mental health. We uh love all of you guys and we will be here next week. Jordan, thank you very much for coming back on the show. It is always a pleasure and, on that note, for me it's if you can't find good people, be good people and uh, yeah, man, what it is is, figure your shit out.
Speaker 2:At the end of the day, figure your shit out what you want to do, how hungry you are. It's up to you. You know it really is. Uh, you have all the map laid out in front of you. You just need to reach out, ask, get a counselor, talk to a friend, go to aa or na. Whatever you need to do, it's in front of you right there. So, figure it the fuck out. Let's fix this shit and move on. Yeah, buddy peace take it easy guys. Be good or be good at it. Bye.